Introduction to Feasting


Food for thought: What’s on your plate?

“ You don’t eat. Don’t eat, get a fragile physique, I’m agile and sleek ”: Rass Kass 2006

Many people, in their quest to understand “What it is I do”  have asked me something along the lines of ” So, what does CHIEFROK eat ?” This is a very difficult question to answer, at least from the frame of reference most people are coming from. I think most people that ask me these sort of questions are either looking for some magic type of superfood, carb/fat ratios, daily amounts of protein etc. I’m guessing, in order to follow me exactly thinking they will get the same exact results. In reality these things shouldn’t be their primary focus. Many ask what kinds of things are they allowed to eat or not allowed to eat on “my diet”. I don’t think diets work so I never go on “diets”, instead I go on “buffets”. The second major problem with these types of questions Is when I’m not trying some weird experiment, what I eat can drastically change from day to day. Obviously with questions about carb ratios and such, these people can’t even imagine a world where they are not obsessively controlling some sort of food, amount or eating behavior. Hopefully this post will encourage people to see past calories, carbs and whatever else they obsess about. Maybe they will let go and realize *they* are not in charge. You will notice below that I am certainly not in charge, my body is.  When you let your body have what it needs regardless how strange that may seem at any given moment, magic happens. It’s not about eating as much as you can, Just try to open up to the idea that you may actually be eating too little and that might be preventing your fat loss. Many people for various reasons actually under-eat, yes even a lot of overweight people!  To paraphrase the quote at the top of the post, you gotta eat people!

Below is day 1 of 3 different days of eating to give you an idea of “how I eat”. Keep in mind all three of these days/meals were eaten during a weight loss regimen that resulted in a pound of weight loss or more per week while counting nothing and eating as much as I wanted and less than 30 mins in the gym a week. Day 2 and 3 will follow in the next posts.

Post workout candy blitz @ 4:30-ish pm

I had an errand to do on the way to the restaurant, got really really hungry so I grabbed a snack, normally I just jump into supper right after working out.


20 mins later, hit the buffet like the Fat Boys!!

Plate 1:

I remember laughing so hard out loud at the giant piece of chicken, thinking GOTDAMN! this must be genetically altered with T-rex genes or something! This thing was bigger than my hand. The picture just does not do it justice nor did the giggling at my table. The corn is piled high on top of the potatoes. the  monster pile of potatoes in itself were quite calorielicious and hard to fully respect via photograph.


I washed it down with some cola.

La Cola Nostra !

Plate 2:

This plate was the epitome of intuitive eating and shows why buffets rule. there are no rules! If the damn cookies were out of the oven they would have made it on this plate instead of desert!

Bourbon chicken with rice, veggies, fish and some brazilian beef and pineapple

lemon lime soda of some sort ( no it’s not diet mofos!)

Plate 3:
For some reason I was on a serious meat mission that day, I’m laughing at the paleo-ness of it now though.

Pot roast and brazilian beef with the roasted pineapple

Part of my methods requires variety in life so I like to switch up flavors this was a Docta Flave,  I believe.

Plate 4:
Whoa The flavor/palatability  was really making me “over consume” that brazilian beef. (According to some I should avoid the tasty stuff)  At this point the manager came over to ask me what I was doing after noticing me take pictures of the food I was eating. My brother told him people need proof! “Do you guys play football and need to gain weight or something?” He asked. My brother told him : “He’s actually on a diet ha ha(referring to me) and I’m just trying to maintain my weight ” The manager replied “I don’t think you’ll lose too much eating like that” To which my brother responded, “He’s done it before and he’s steady losing weight for the last 5 weeks like this.” ( I was still chewing )  Then I said “It’s true” ”
You should  get your company to sponsor me and I’ll show ya’ how it’s done.” His eyes got real big with a puzzled look on his face. He spent so much time talking to us, we had time to get another plate.

More Brazilian beef sweet potatoes……with butta baby


Yet another Soda Popinski!


Plate 5:
I usually don’t do dessert and never at the end. We normally grab some cookies at the start of the meal. This particular visit we were thwarted  in our cookie hunting by what seemed to be an entire fat camp that had escaped after being subjected to salad torture. They kept getting all the cookies as soon as they came out of the oven. Our table was quite close to the desert section so as soon as we smelled the chocolate chip goodness we swooped on them like vultures. Which only made the manager laugh when we returned. My brother had 3 times as many  cookies as me. The amazing thing is he has never been overweight and on this day ( like most days) he ate everything I did and then some ! ( an extra couple of fountain drinks to boot.)



I never eat the icing

Those cookies are badass though, notice in the lemon/lime beverage shot below you can see I cheated and left behind some icing ( there you have it, my secret is not eating icing!)


In the south they call this Coke

A little later that evening:

After leaving the buffet we had some projects to work on. About 2 hours later we got pretty hungry and had to made a quick stop. I asked my brother if he wanted some steak subs? He looked at me with a devilish grin and gave me the “Mr Miyagi nod” and we Crane-kicked the shit out of some steak subs and black cherry soda!


4th meal think inside the bun

I wish they had this stuff at the buffet

128 Responses to “Introduction to Feasting”

  1. John says:

    Best…post…ever…thanks Chief! I thought I was kicking a$$ with my meals…you put me to shame! 🙂

  2. Bob Dean says:

    I’ve been waiting for you to write something since we spoke in december/january lol. I’m still looking forward to the sumo post. I didn’t read this yet, but I’m sure as hell excited you’re not dead and starting to post again HELL YEAH =P

  3. Bob Dean says:

    Awesome post dude, I wish we had better buffets around here, I’m seriously soo tired of the selection I have lol. That stuff you got looks #beastmode =D I cant wait till I’m in good shape and smashin like you. I’ve already gotten pleeeenty of attention smashing as much as I do, and have gained pleeenty of weight.

  4. Bob Dean says:

    elyria ohio!

    • chief says:

      there is definitely good ones in your area Drove through there before open your eyes holmes, near midway mall is one i think near the turnpike.

  5. Matt Stone says:

    This makes me happy Chief. I’m kind of at a crossroads right now where I have put on some fat (and tons of muscle and strength) and am feeling awesome. But the fat gain gets me all scurr’d, making me fantasize about starving myself out in the wilderness until the fat comes off. This gives me great encouragement not to give up, but to take this to completion – just as I advise people to do. So much easier said than done when you don’t have someone like you nearby reassuring you that what you are doing is THE WAY.

    • chief says:

      I’m honored you stopped by, after all I vaguely understood what a blog was when I stumbled onto your site and it was the catalyst for making my own blog what I was originally calling an online magazine lol. Don’t go hiking naked for 2 months now! your down a very good path towards understanding.

      • Steve says:

        I don’t understand how you can loose weight while eating such a large amount of calories. This doesn’t make sense to me

        • CHIEF says:

          unplug from the matrix my friend most of what you have been lead to believe as far as obesity is false. Its not purposely eating very little that gets the best long term results.

          • Steve says:

            Usually I eat my first meal at 4pm and last meal at 8pm. Would it be better if I ate all my food in one sitting instead of spreading it out in those 4 hours?

            • CHIEF says:

              most people get better results putting the majority into one sitting. the problem lies in smaller framed individuals having a harder time taking in large amounts of food when they are used to small portions due to “life-training”. the trick in that situation is to focus on calorie density in one sitting and snack on the opposite ends of meal time ( 4 pm and 8 pm) gradually phasing into less calorie dense snacks until your body just responds to the influx of calories at meal times and seek out less dense foods at snack times.

              • Steve says:

                Just out of curiosity, about how many calories do you think you can fit into your meal when you are trying to get leaner?

                • CHIEF says:

                  the above pictures where taken at one meal, at one buffet restaurant plus snacks ( chocolate bars before and steak sub “snack” lol afterwards. this was a typical meal during that particular weight loss undertaking. I would say I or any other human can do the same again whenever the need.

                  I have consistently rocked it in the 5000-8000 calorie range while systematically losing fat without interruption.

                  • Steve says:

                    that just breaks all the rules. Do you drink beer? I tend to drink craft beer with my meals usually.

                    • CHIEF says:

                      i drink so infrequently I would refer to myself as a non drinker but when I do…… look out!
                      I definitely would not suggest drinking alcohol if weight loss was the person’s goal. Not that it makes it impossible or causes weight gain but anything that hinders the body’s normal function will only impede automatic/natural weight loss and at minimum slow the desired results down.

                      “Some of their rules can be bent, Others can be broken”

                    • Steve says:

                      How could you achieve such a caloric load without access to an evening buffet? I’m guessing with pizza, subs, ice cream etc..?

              • Steve says:

                do you mean eat my main meal at 4 and snack at 8? Most days I work between those times.

    • nola says:

      Hi Matt

      I am curious as to what exactly are you doing in terms of your eating?

      Earlier in the year I started eating to appetite and very intuitively, which I feel is what we should all be doing naturally;
      but I got to a point where the weight gain was more than I could tolerate so I just ended up restricting food to a level where I wouldnt gain weight …again.. (I have been down this path before, and halted it then too when the weight gain become intolerable..)

      It is my desire to let loose and really follow my body-
      but not at the expense of endlessly gaining weight- and the question is-
      “does it ever stop”, and “do you end up being able to lose it without going back to calorie restriction?”

      I dont like restricting calories and holding back my body,
      but I decided this was preferable to continuing to gain weight and ending up looking in a way I didnt like.

      My goal is to find a way to have both!
      ie to be able to eat in a natural satisfying satiating way, without counting, calculating, restricting and restraining,
      and also to have a body that looks decent and is a good lean weight.

      Which is why I am here reading away..

      • Ali says:

        Nola, I feel the exact same way. I would love to see some more posts on the particulars of Chief’s way of eating and what he recommends for us. Also more info on the process of the weight loss.

        I can barely stand the 30 lbs I’ve put on, I was a size 6 several months ago. I’m hanging on by fingernails hoping that what I’m doing will help my health and happiness. Trying to trust, but it is barely tolerable. The fight inside my head is certainly not doing much to alleviate any stress. I want to be friends with my body, though, and trust that it can communicate to me what it needs. I haven’t listened before.

        Chief, any comments would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!!

        • nola says:

          Well I am not chief, but all I can say is that I fully understand how you feel!
          Gaining weight always activates all of my inner fears , insecurities and bad feelings within myself.
          When I am in a gaining weight cycle, it is traumatic and forces me to look at the inner issues that are being uncovered.
          For me controlling my weight controls the trauma,
          not controlling my weight unleashes a lot of stuff- fear, feeling of betrayal by the body, feelings of fat and ugly, feelings of my body out of control, and so on.
          I cant say I have come to the end of it either. I am still stuck in this conundrum that seems to be something like this;
          if I let go and trust my instincts in terms of food and eating,
          I gain weight, uncontrollably (so far I have never reached a stabilization phase when trying this out);
          and this makes it hard for me to trust and love my body,
          it feels wrong and bad! and is impossible (so far) for me to live with for any length of time.
          The last time I tried this letting go thing- I stopped it and said, internally,
          “unless I can see some proof or have some reassurance that I will stop gaining weight and things will level out and normalize,
          I am going back to a diet restriction” ie, I need to have something to believe in to be able to keep letting go and trusting this process.
          I am stuck at that point- still lightly restricting my diet, maintaining, and hovering in the balance between holding on and letting go!

          • chief says:

            Hi Nola. how can you be sure there is no limit to your weight gain. HOw much have you gained? how much of it was water ? what was the starting weight. I’m 100% sure you like everyone else on this planet has an upper limit under normal conditions.

            • nola says:

              When I am gaining- I stop weighing.
              But from the look and fit (non-fit) of clothes, I have gained 20+ pds in times of eating abundantly, and even then the weight is still climbing.
              At this point I lose tolerance and faith and stop.

              I guess there would be an upper limit- I just dont want to find

              I find it psychologically hard to gain any weight at all, and 20 pds kills me.

              I have worked so hard to try to get my body to be some kind of weight that I can live with ;
              that gaining after having had to laboriously and painfully lose every pound sucks.

              I feel like I have let go several times- but have had it slap me in the face, and am extremely not wanting to repeat the experience!

              To let go now, I want guarantees, or some kind of end in sight.
              Impossible to give I know- but I need a solid reason or hope to relinquish my current dietary control-
              because as much as it is sometimes a tug of war between my hunger and the desire to control my weight ;
              this is not as painful to me as gaining and living in a body I am not happy in.

              Some people do gain, and dont neccessarily lose?
              Is the secret complete abandon?
              I have usually maintained some degree of control when eating more- ie, not rrarfing to the nth degree, more trying to just eat to hunger and follow that.

        • chief says:

          not much to go on with your comment Ali, I couldn’t help much without a lot more information.

  6. Zach says:

    Im guessing this should be obvious but were you fasting all day until 4:30? Did you hit the gym fasted as well?

    • chief says:

      This particular day I fasted all day, hit the gym fasted but it was a real short workout under 6 minutes, I sweated and I had some water with the candy got some odd looks eating candy at a gym from all the treadmill zombies. I purposely eat it in front of them.

  7. deb says:

    Oh My. You must be a very happy man. 🙂
    deb xo

    • chief says:

      if you read the recent boner comment, eating with a hardcore metabolism makes for happy ladies, a happy lady makes for a happy man.

  8. Dabs says:

    Wow Chief ammmmmazing:-) how long had you gone without food before the feast and how long will you normally wait before the next one. I have sometimes started going two days between feedings and in the second day without food my energy levels go through the roof

    • chief says:

      24 hours without food and you’ll see the next post was about 24 hours later.

      • chief says:

        side note: I just thought of something, this 24 hours mentioned above is not including eating because that time varies, so maybe 22 to 23 hours fasted on average. Obviously the random steak sub popping up here throws those numbers off a bit on this particular day.

  9. Rocket says:

    I’m very curious to read these posts.

    I have a rough idea of how you go about this bit I’m still vague on your specifics.
    Hopefully the 2 follow up posts will give a clear picture of a weightloss Chiefweek.

  10. Bob Dean says:

    Chief, I can feel my boobs jiggle when I hit bumps driving, and I don’t like it…but I’m not giving up. I’m gettin stronger, but not bulkin too much, but I’m purposely taking it kinda easy still, my body needs healin from all the years of not eatin enough I suppose. My wrist is still sprained from last year, and I can’t do chin ups or nothin and it really sucks. I am so eager to understand this all more, and I can’t wait for that damn Sumo post. I was just talking to a friend about all the eating I’m doing and he said well what about Sumo wrestlers, and I don’t know what to say! Maybe they never allow their revved up metabolisms to burn anything off cuz they’re constantly eating, or maybe they dont eat a variety so its stressful I DONT KNOW lol. =) I told you where I lived so aren’t you gonna tell me the best place to go haha. I went to Ryans in sandusky, and it is a lot better than anything I’ve seen so far. Something gave me IBS for four hours yesterday, its discouraging…

    • Narain says:

      Bob, I’d be a bit careful here. You mentioned the revved up metabolism of sumo wrestlers – i think they actually have down regulated their metabolism. Also, a Japanese friend told me that they do not eat constantly. They actually skip breakfast (thus slowing metabolism) eat two huge meals and sleep after each meal.

  11. Rocket says:


    Yeah, I wasn’t intending to duplicate your meals lol.
    I was more curious to know how the macros change from day to day.
    I’ve lost weight having a blow out one day, just veg fruit and rice for two days then another blow out.
    So the vegan 2 days followed by a day of carnivorous satisfaction has been good for me – also not eating till lunchtime helps.

    – and speed it up bro, people are interested : )

  12. Narain says:

    Chief, That is a massive amount of food ! I found you on 180. I’m not sure I understand your approach though. I read through Chiefrok principles and assumed you are for fasting and then eating one big meal a day after some physical activity. But above, you ate the ginormous meal and then 2 hours later you went and ate again – so are you more into eat when you get hungry or feasting once a day? Have you found your approach to help with sleep? If I overeat in the evening my stomach is stuffed and i dont sleep well.

    • chief says:

      CHIEFROK principles is a work in progress. if you look to the very bottom there is a list of principles that will be links soon. these links will take you to the various fundamental aspects of “What it is i do” attempting “a go at what I do” on your own without at least letting one post elaborate each of these principles, enter at your own risk I would not expect the same results.

      I started answering your question and it got real long. I’m gong to put it in the how to fast guide. short answer I eat one big meal a day but also eat when I’m hungry lol

      I sleep very very well and wake up without an alarm. we shall get into the circadian rhythm soon enough.

  13. Narain says:

    Thanks Chief! look forward to the “how to fast” and circadian
    Rhythms posts. I’d love to get a handle on getting a good
    Refreshing nights sleep.

    • chief says:

      no problem, circadian rhythm is a biggy, without getting proper rest it is very difficult to have a tremendous amount of success elsewhere. It directly relates to having your hunger signals pop up like clock work as well.

  14. Bryan says:

    Hey Chief very interesting post. In your experience have you handled any Type 2 Diabetics before? I’d be interested if your methodologies were the same or if you were integrating fasting and feasts with them as well. I look at those pictures and drool. I seem to be in a catch 22 lately, when I eat big my blood sugar skyrockets (300-400mg/dl) but it is also when I feel best. I know your methods have merit as I have experienced many of there benefits, but do you have any insight on how to juggle that while keeping blood glucose in check for someone with impaired tolerance?

    • chief says:

      Hi Bryan, I have worked with diabetics before. My dad was diagnosed with it and he cured it. His Diagnosis was actually the catalyst to figuring all this stuff out putting me on to this mission. I got really worried when I realized everyone over 25 had it on that side of the family yet they were lean and with all of the information by heath organization on rez they always said it is more likely being fat and native to develop it so i decided to do something about it. I wouldn’t jump into something as dashing as this if I was dealing with diabetes. I would get it running a little better first through nutritional supplementation, some special teas alot of rest and small forays into feasting. I have seen alot of success with a short spurt of low fat low sugar mostly raw veggies for a week or so with alot of rest while watching for glucose improvements then easing into the feasting with some starchy foods and starting a weight training regimen. (thats a big part of it too) It certainly far more tricky but still doable with my general approaches. I recommend doing a lot of research before playing around with it especially in terms of glycogen/muscles and pancreas function and liver function because it’s easy to mess up. A good start in the world of diabetes would be matt stone’s of 180 diabetes material. I have not read it but judging by his comments and articles he does understand it quite well. I do hope to get to get to diabetes in my blog but there are tidbits in my post up to now that relate.

      • Bryan says:

        I really appreciate that Chief. I’ve actually worked directly with Matt(its how I found you) before and given my response to fasting and my elevated glucose he actually recommended Bernstein (low carb) …its been a rough go as my digestive system, metformin and low carb don’t really get along if you know what I mean. I would be interested in hearing more details on what you think may work for me, if you are providing consultantions online id be game, provided you’re not too expensive.

        • chief says:

          if he recommended low carb, I would think your in need of some help and I have trouble turning people away if I can help.

          It’s not expensive in my opinion and all of the proceeds from online consulting in terms of weight training and dietary approaches I do is donated to non profit organizations. I’m not in it for the money at all.

          Send me an email and I can ask some pretty personal questions to see if there is anything I may be able to help with it may not even cost you anything if It doest take much of my time. justaskchief (at) gmail com

  15. Bryan says:

    Can you comment on how your Dad cured his diabetes? I know it may not be applicable to my situation, but just the thought of completely reversing it sounds wonderful in my book.

    • chief says:

      I don’t like to go into a lot of detail with very tricky things where there is a lot of risk of someone hurting themselves or creating more problems. Basically it was traditional native medicine combined with some dietary approaches and closely monitoring everything.

  16. Narain says:

    Brace yourself or ignore the constructive criticism that follows 🙂
    I appreciate the advice that you are giving out here and on the comments in 180. A recent comment you made on 180 was how Matt’s answer was clearer than yours but you were both trying to say the same thing.

    I think saying more with less is important in blogging and provides clarity when presented well. For example, check out this page:
    An 8 year old could follow along with the above.

    Again, totally respect what you are doing but you could get the message out much further with the right approach.

    • chief says:

      Thank you Narain, I love constructive criticism from anyone, I dislike negativity and hateful comments though they don’t move us forward. I would appreciate any other future comments or questions on clarity, they will help me make the blog much better. ( from anyone)

      I wish it was as simple as lean gains approach it would have gotten liked across world of facebook by now. Sadly I think It’ll take about 3 to 5 posts minimum for each of the principles to be understandable due to all of these concepts being so different from the mainstream. simply saying things like “Step one : Eat a ton of food at a buffet, will only result in people calling me crazy and arguments over laws of thermodynamics and slowing things down. ( there is a method to my madness)

      I have finally gotten around to filling in the respective synopses ( a little) found in the CHIEFROK principles category. I think this is what you are talking about, i was waiting to get more explanation posts done to back them up, but i figured just make the whole thing a work in progress after your

      Matt has always smoked me in the written form with concise explanations and not having rezzed out grammar (n shit), I do much better speaking, and in large crowds. I talk more drawn out and figurative and organically like the pimp in hustle and flow, we just have a very different way of expressing things.

      • Narain says:

        Chief, thanks for responding ! Yes, I agree that it is certainly hard to simplify this complex topic. The outlines and work in progress that you have laid out are great. I think your style is also unique so that is a good thing too 🙂

  17. Nyle says:

    Thanks for all this free info, Chief!
    Do you know anything about diet as related to hair loss? From what I’ve read, it seems like keeping stress hormones in check is key. I’ve been eating only one or two big meals per day for several months now and it has helped stabilize my mood (I don’t get pissed off as often or as easily). The only dietary guidelines I could find on this topic involved eating mostly milk, orange juice and raw carrots (no joke).

    • chief says:

      Hey Nyle, Stress hormones should be in check for everything! Feasting up a storm and fixing your metabolism helps in alot of people, like Bob Dean mentioned above, he got some titties from it but his hair is thicker than ever.

  18. cave johnson says:

    How to the hell do you eat lots of calories and not get ill? Lately I’ve been experimenting with eating 4-5k calories a day (typically I’m happy with around 3k) and after 2-3 days I simply can not bring myself to eat like that anymore and drop down to 2k or so. I’m really curious about some of your tricks in your bag.

    • Bob Dean vs Food says:

      You are becoming ill or sick of the food for a good reason. I think it means your body is working correctly. To a person that has been starved for a long time, like dieting, I think they would be able to maintain a higher level of eating for longer due to their hormonal state. But I guess the saying goes, hurry up and gain the fat so you can start losing. So the faster we give our bodies what it wants, the better. Just because Chief is eating these large meals doesnt mean he could sustain them. I think that if he got fat on purpose his body is starving so he’ll be able to eat more. I think I might be right =P Good luck! I got some tits right now but I don’t regret getting them on purpose! Hair loss started at 18,(22 now) its not falling out anymore, and the hair I do have is thicker than I ever remember. Keep the information coming MR.ROK

    • chief says:

      No easy way to explain it, I’m working on all of the posts but like bob was eluding to, the calorie count is meaningless.

  19. Hi CHIEF, I found you over on 180degrees and tried to post a comment but it’s still waiting moderation. Do you have an email add? I have some quesitons and reading your stuff nad commentary etc has me thinking a lot about a lot of things, lol.

  20. I was just reading your comments on 180degrees and yours posts on your own site and found myself totally focused and going WOW for a long time.. which is pretty cool alone since my focus is sort of questionable 😀 Anyhow, I’m really curious on this fasting thing, especially for women. You mentioned that you’ve worked with females… I’m not overweight at all, but was a chubbster when I was a kid, from about 8-10, and it really freaked me out. I got thin naturally just from growing and science, but then I starved msyelf when I got to middle school, which later led to the opposite end of the spectrum. I spent the next many years hating my body/food and just created this ridiculous food prison. I finally made peace with it all last year but I worry how much damage I did to myself? So I went Paleo cuz I thought my body would freak out if I ate a carb… lol, not at all. Actually by the holidays last year I was back on all foods. These days I’m just trying to live life but be badass and fatproof. I found IFing and am curious about it, but read that it is not good for women, especially more petite women with nto as much BF and who are physically active. I train for races and do a lot lifting, not cuz I have to, just cuz I actually am a weirdo that likes it. If I could be anythign, it’d be an action figure 🙂 So my question is, can small chicks who workout fast and is it a good idea?

    • chief says:

      Action figures are awesome. I’m currently trying to become batman and iron man at the moment. 🙂

      Regardless of gender, I usually tell people to start small and gradually find their sweet spot.

      If you read methods of my grandfather’s generation, (
      I speak about doing heavy work in a fasted state. I don’t advise people to do a great deal of fasted work in particular with lengthy fasts. I would definitely call the running your talking about heavy work. If you feel really good and are

      I will try to clarify the information you seek and how I go about this in a fasting how to post.

      • danni anne says:

        thank you!!! i gotta figure out what else to say besides “you rok” since i’m sure that must get old for you, lol.
        i like that post about your grandfather’s generation, it makes total sense.

  21. ohhhhh and i forgot to mention, i had/have a KILLER sweet tooth and feel like a junkie when i’m on it. i have gone through sugar-free times and felt ok, but now i’m back on it. honestly it doesnt’ feel good but i can’t seem to get up the energy to quit it again.. sigh.

  22. EQ says:

    Wow. This eating is no joke! So, I’ve just completed month 2 of ‘eating the food’ during which time I have gained almost all of my fatass back. I certainly was a fatty in a less fatass body. Now I’m just all fatass again. The trouble is, how to get past the intense FEAR of being SOOOO fat again? Also, now that I’ve been eating the food again I’ve been getting way over full and feeling awful afterward. I haven’t been fasting. Reading this post today is the first I’ve heard this concept. Does it help with the crazy gross feeling after eating? Cuz that’d be great. I can put down the food but it’s such a bad feeling after that I go back to restricting again. Thoughts? Oh ya, and, I’m NOT a big exersizer. I’m trying for something I can think of doing for a lifetime so am shooting for once a week right now, high intensity helps with that. And, trying to do some short hikes down the gorge to our river for relaxed picnic meals with the hubby and kids once a week to get some more pleasant and stress free effort into my life. Can I try buffeting at breakfast and fasting till the next breakfast? Does one just push through the hunger for the first 3 days and then settle in for fasting and feasting? I’d love to give this a try, im an absolute huge fan of massive feasts… but wonder what it would look like and how to keep from feeling like crap afterward.

    • chief says:

      EQ, the gross feeling you mentioned never happens to me.
      I only have one experience with the Gross you describe to go on, I was in my early teens not eating enough due to poverty and just pounded as much as I could at a free meal and felt terrible not long after.During this time I usually ate three meals a day but I’m not sure that was to blame in my case or yours. I suspect if you only eat to appetite instead of trying to eat as much as possible it would get rid of this issue.

      working out is a good idea period. even 2 minutes a day provided you have no major issue and you have rested enough. Once a week if done right would be enough to maintain a great life along with the fun activities you mentioned.

      NO that’s a bad idea for fasting, I’m about 3/4 of the way done with a fasting how to guide started yesterday and I plan on finishing tonight, please wait before fasting on your own it’s a slippery slope, I promise to hurry.

      • douglass shityounot says:

        Is there a buffet you tend to frequent most often? I am interested in bumping in to you some day. Also, when is that sugar challenge video hitting the web? It’s been at least a month and I am dying to see what you did in action.

      • I’m testimony to that… tried it on my own, got absolutely nowhere and my hair started falling out again! Incidentally I also get that major gross feeling if i eat a lot at a meal, it’s like the food is just sits in my gullet for 7 plus hours…
        so am back to relatively normal meals again, trying my best to give my body what it asks for but i’m becoming a little afraid my body is just a greedy pig and wants to eat non-stop every single day and i’m destined to be a fatty for the rest of my life 🙂
        regardless, I’m looking forward to all the “how-to” stuff as it pops up.

  23. EQ says:

    Ok, I’ll wait. I may not be able to fast at all anyway, I forgot to mention that I’m breast feeding. That may put a kink in it. Also, I was really thinking through why eating has been making me feel so bad and there are a couple of factors I think may be playing into it. I’m over stressing about a family wedding coming up soon and been putting revising-my-state-of-mental-starvation on the back burner. Difficult to deal with since one eats three times a day (potentially 5xs with preparing food for my kiddos, as they refuse to eat decent amounts and get hungry all the time). I really have the mental starvation thing bad, hard to believe when I’m pushing 200lbs! How long does it take to get over that? Matt recommended 30 days but I certainly just went back to the crazy food thoughts as soon as I couldnt fit into my clothes anymore. I’m thinking the gross feeling may be caused by or connected to the starvation thoughts and the stress.
    So, honestly is this whole battle just in our heads? Or is there more? And really, how long does it take to undo 36 years of wrong thoughts about food?

    • chief says:

      Eat to appetite and listen to your body every minute of the day. I doubt anyone would natural fast in that situation but listen to your body and it may let you naturally fast it may not. I’m sure it has happened and that’s the sort of thing fat stores are designed for but I wouldn’t think it would be optimal. Breast feeding is not something that I have studied quite enough to say so I guess I should do some research, time to hit the strip club! 🙂

      As far as perception of starvation, it only ends when you hit the set point for fat. get your head around the stress element then work on the rest. just focus on being a good mom most of the rest is outside of your hands anyway, you can’t control everything take a few of those purple pills.

  24. EQ says:

    Ooooo… The dread statement: listen to your body every minute of the day. Rough! I really am working on doing that but I’ve gotta say, it’s WAY easier just to have a hard and fast rule. I’m getting better at it though. Lots of times I just see something tasty and put it in my mouth before consulting in any way with the old body to see if it needs it. In fact, I believe I am currently chewing a piece of watermelon based solely on the fact that it is sitting in a bowl beside me appealing with its cool mouthwatering juiciness to help with my plight to beat the heat of living in a 107 year old house with a tin roof. Not so much nutrition or hunger related at all but I have every confidence that I could finish the entire melon off before I finish doing the dishes if I inadvertently leave putting them in the refrigerator till after rather than before that little chore. Aghrrrr.
    Anyway, while I work on listening, would you mind directing me to your writing on weight set point? I searched this site and can’t seem to locate it anywhere. Loved reading your stuff though :). Makes so much sense. I would love to hear more on weight set point though. I’m assuming it would be the highest point it got to when it last felt nourished? But, you know what happens when you ass-u-me…
    Oh ya, and, someone mentioned T-Tapp for exersize in conjunction with metabolism reset attempts. It seems like something I could really enjoy and fit into my life. Do you have any thoughts on that? If not, more fodder for the strip club;)
    Oh ya, and thanks for the purple pill advice. I’m working on that in so many areas. Works perfectly as long as I remember it before I get too entrenched in the *€&$#*

  25. Sly says:


    I have been reading your blog for the last few days after initially finding you on Matt stone’s 180DegreeHealth trying to wrap my head around it all. Buffets and feasts like this, no macronutrient ratio counting and losing weight? No way!

    Well I am 35 yrs old 5’5′ and a little over two yrs ago was 186 lbs. I added in IF and wen down to 165 lbs where I hit a plateau and couldn’t lose much more. Then came along Paleo which has assisted along with IF in getting me down to 144lbs currently with a decrease in joint pain, and Asthma symptoms have improved and rarely do I get sick! which would be a great success story with the exception of the issues I have seemed to develop since then? Besides the irritability and sex drive issues (as well as other problems in that area) I seem fatigued some days and spacy. Not to mention the effect it’s had on my social life with me avoiding birthday gatherings and such during the week and some family functions it’s crazy.

    I’m the only one who if I do attend such an occasion has the meal of Meat, Veggies, and Fat while everyone eats all the tasty stuff. At first I would give them the”it’s what I like” bologna. Yeah I enjoyed it to a degree but I also wanted to enjoy other foods as well. One of my friends is always making this tasty carby stuff like Tacos, Mac n Cheese, Homemade desserts and Pastas and whenever I visit she always has a plate prepared and I always decline and that upsets me even more? Carbs =Insulin spikes and weight gain??

    So now reading this blog and what your saying I am wondering how is this possible to incorporate into my everyday life without totally undoing all I have achieved including my abs being visual for the first time since forever and avoiding turning into a mini, shorter version of the Stay Puft Marshmallow Man? I’m sure this could help soo many as I’ve read through some of the comments and questions here. I emailed a pic of my current condition and hope to be pointed in the right direction at least.

    As far as my routine weekly it’s usuall 6 days a week. # days of strength training in the 5- 10 rep range with compound lifts. Chins, Dips, Goblet Squats, Shoulders Press, DB Incline Press etc with some core work. Then there’s 3 days of GPP conditioning work that I add in with mostly bodyweight. I fast until maybe 4-6 pm for an average of maybe 20 hours or so. Any assistance in pointing me to the right direction would be greatly appreciated. If there is a better way I am all ears..


    • chief says:

      Hey Sly Yes fffin way! No counting anything except the tip for the waitress.
      keep reading it is achievable by all.

      Carbs as you can see in the above pictures, will not “spike your shit” and cause insidious fat gain as previously touted by low carb gurus and paleophiles. 🙂

      first step would be see how your body is doing, introduce some carbs one day at a time and see how your body handles them.
      You may need to temporarily lose the abs, being a small framed guy it will be easier to get back there though.
      I will be doing an experiment into the pursuit of abs, I don’t really care for them one way or the other but the ” I need to know factor” has me prepared to do a 6 month experiment, cruisin’ down “abbey” road to see if abs and buffets mix. If they do not mix, I will conclude abs are ab-normal for most people if eating ad libitum makes them impossible to maintain.

      I would allow for more rest in your workout, especially given your current dietary dogma. The compound lifts if done correctly will leave you “Generally Physically Prepared” for anything life can throw atcha. I’ll be filling in the workout posts pretty soon, even though I feel people will focus too much on what I do as far as exercise and what I do at a buffet and have very little success.

      I would think you never getting sick will be short lived they way you are achieving it having a high metabolism is the only way i know of keeping that going long term.

      if you are fasting and eating low carb, it would be like pushing your car to get better gas milage. You will pay for a shit load more food than gas to move it an equal distance. If the idea of low carb is to keep insulin low, fasting will do the exact same thing on it’s own, so in essence you are avoiding macaroni and cheese for absolutely no significant difference in amount of “spike yo shit” insulin.

      it might take a few more posts and comments to get you going in the right direction for now try to eat a carb meal this week and see how it goes one day at a time. I’d be willing to bet you would see no significant difference “cheating’ once a week. take baby steps and you will soon be leaping into buffets.

  26. John says:


    Good stuff in this post. As you know I have gone to one meal a day and have been for a little over a month now. The transition just happened out of the blue and I haven’t looked back. I am, however, still learning a lot about it and how my body reacts. Outside of a cheat meal on Fridays (which is anything I want, and usually very sugar and fat heavy), my meals are very clean. I noticed that at least one night a week (maybe an hour or two AFTER my one meal) I would get a craving of sorts for something sweet and sugary. In this case, Apple Jacks. Once eaten, I was satisified. I noticed this craving came on Tuesdays or Wendesdays, so 4-5 days after my cheat meal. My body, I think, is just low on sugar since my normal meals are not sugar heavy at all and my body is “ordering it up.” Like in your other posting about cravings, I did not ignore it and instead honored what my body wanted. It worked…craving gone and I make it to my next cheat meal fine. I have not had this craving over the last few weeks, so it might have been a temporary thing, but in any event it pays to listen to your body.

  27. Amber Williams says:

    OMG dude, I’m literally astonished by how much you can eat!!! Thank you for doing what you do. You must be busy and it looks like you put a lot of work into your blog and I’m grateful. Keep em’ coming, I’m so anxious to read more. I just feel like after reading through everything so far that I just might finally have found what I need. I’ve been looking to End my constant struggle with dietary obsession. I’m not fat at all but so afraid to get fat I keep a log of everything that I eat and I keep a calorie balance sheet and I obsessively read every label!! SAVE ME!! Since stumbling on to your site via google I have been mesmerized by your posts, I should be working right now but OMG I haven’t spent this much time online at my desk in a long time! he he 😛
    Your whole style is very unique!!! I’ve gotten a fair amount of laughs and insights in one day. Thanks, You Rock Mr. Rok!!!!

  28. Mark says:

    Is fasting required to get your results?

    • chief says:

      I’m going to answer that fully in an upcoming post, mark. I’ll give a short answer for now. It’s more of a cumulative thing,like academic grades certain test count for more points. it is possible for some to achieve but every single thing i do helps to some degree and “adds up”. The big question for me is why have an aversion to it or a need to avoid it? your already fasting while you sleep so extending it a little is no more unnatural.

      • Mark says:

        Looking forward to the post. I’m actually just a high school kid and it’s hard to miss meals.

        • chief says:

          Makes perfect sense, If I was in your shoes I wouldn’t do any fast your still growing and could just about eat while you sleep even. Seriously though most people underestimate how many calories an active brain needs, your doing “farmer work days” in my eyes by learning all day.

          what’s your situation ? what are you looking to do?

  29. Matt says:

    Its interesting coming back to this post after a month or so and seeing how much my perspective on it has changed. When I first read it, I was coming from a “some food bad, some food good” perspective, but having read your blog and Matt Stone’s blog, this style of eating, as well as the things being eaten, make a lot more sense when taken in context (high metabolism). If someone who has been doing paleo for a while were to suddenly starting pounding carbs and soda, they’d probably see some serious ill-effects, and chalk it up to the inherent unhealthiness of the foods they were eating. However, when you have the concept of metabolic rate underlying everything, things start to make a little more sense, and become less about the specifics, and more about the bigger picture. Thanks for helping save me from nutritional suicide bra.


    • chief says:

      Your welcome Matt. I’m glad you have found a new appreciation for the post and have found your way a little farther down the rabbit hole.

      “some food bad, some food good” sounds like you were quoting Ol’ Grok directly there. Tell em’ I said “Carbs yummy”

  30. Zach says:

    Did you save the pictures of day 2 and 3? I totally forgot about this post but i remember being really excited to see the other days.

    Eating huge meals at a sitting has always been a strong suit of mine and seeing how much you can put down is majorly impressive. I think i can get there though. 😀

    • CHIEF says:

      i have a week of feasting post that will be released consecutively in conjunction with key info in the principles.

      • Graham says:

        Looking forward to those, I don’t get cravings for food even though I get fucking hungry, (I know how fucked up that sounds, and I’m working on it, haha) but I felt something in my guts looking at those plates of food and drink. I need to try more buffets.

  31. Graham says:

    Steve, I’d highly recommend stew cooked in a slow cooker. All of the nutrition stays in the stew (as opposed to most forms of cooking where you lose a fair amount,) you can cook it with anything you like and get it to taste anyway you like, and you can’t fuck up cooking it because you just throw everything in and leave it. Add a few sugary drinks and some ice cream and you’ve got yourself a pretty calorie dense evening. That’s the only thing I’ve found that comes remotely close to a buffet. It tends to be fairly cheap as well once you’ve bought the slow cooker.

    • CHIEF says:

      Yea thats a very good suggestion. I have been meaning to post pictures of the supper I had the day after this supper for a while just haven’t found a missing photo in my drives but it has a homecooked “buffet spread” that is kind of typical of how I get down.

      Koodos Graham! we need to get a recipe section going.

      • Graham says:

        Looking forward to those pictures Chief, I’d love to see what foods you vary between from day to day.

        You should definitely get a recipe section going, I plan on making my own chocolate and junk food soon, (way too much vegetable oil and not enough saturated fat or sugar in food nowadays, I’d been wondering why chocolate didn’t taste as good as when I was a kid, I get sick of the stuff long before I get full now,) and I could do with some different recipes for cookies and stuff like that.

        Here’s my stew to get things started, I fucking love this stuff, it’s better than chocolate to my tastes.

        -2kg chicken (all the skin, no prep work)
        -Beef liver (heart or kidney will do, but I find liver is just better)
        -Potatoes (chopped, i don’t wash the starch off like most seem to)
        -Onions (chopped)
        -Chicken Gravy (enough to cover the whole thing)
        -A whole stick of salted butter (tends to be about 250g, I’m going to try more soon though)
        -Lots of salt (I just add enough till it tastes quite salty)
        -Lots of pepper

        The basic premise is one type of meat, one organ meat, 2 types of condoments (salt, pepper, etc), a starchy food, a vegetable or 2, and lots of butter and gravy. Obviously play with it till you find what you like, I just prefer a smaller amount of variation so it isn’t bland, but few enough ingredients that I just get a really strong taste that hits the fucking mark.

        I feel much better after a meal with this stew, ice cream/cookies and coke. My anxiety and fatigue lifts a lot until I get hungry again, and i think I sleep better when I eat this regularly. I’m not saying this will work the same for everyone, but I seem to cover most bases with a meal like this.

      • mike d says:

        that looks similar to what those damn Sumo’s eat. Which, considering they eat the same basic meal thing every day, I would imagine there is something to it. I always feel really good after a big bowl of stew, myself. i would add another starch (probably rice) and another veggie or two like mushrooms or whatever my fancy was for the day.

        i really like slow cookers, but the thing is they don’t cook fast enough, or do they? can they cook something in an hour? i know pressure cookers are great for quick cooking (do crazy shit like cook rice in 3 minutes), but can you cook a stew in a pressure cooker? anyways, i mention this because i usually don’t know what the hell i want until i’m hungry, so i can’t like, guess in the morning and hope i’m right for the afternoon.

    • Steve says:

      have you experienced fat gain eating like this? thanks for the tip

      • Graham says:

        My weight has been stable (hard to say how stable, I don’t very often check the scales) for quite a few months. I finished gaining weight about 5 months back and then I had some really stressful weeks which nuked my digestion, and I couldn’t eat much and as a result my weight went up a bit (about half a stone) and I got a few stretch marks around my love handles. Since then I’ve started making sure I keep enough of all types of food about (I started making this stew after that, and I consume lots of ice cream and coke, and chocolate biscuits whenever I’m hungry,) and my weight has been stable since, and the stretch marks are starting to fade really nicely as well.

        The short answer to your question is, I’m still at my highest weight (which really isn’t that high, I still look normal, almost skinny next to most,) but I haven’t gained any fat eating like this, it seems to have stabilised my weight and leaned me out a little it if anything. I should say though, my energy levels and mood have improved drastically since eating more like this.

      • mike d says:

        Yes, you probably will. Depends on where you are at in the scheme of things. I definitely did, but I was only eating ground beef and potatoes. Shit, when I switched from potatoes to rice I gained 30lbs in a few weeks. I’m currently at around 210 last I checked. My heaviest was 230. Mostly muscle though. Not saying I don’t have some fat on me though haha.

        • Graham says:

          Funny, I’m at around 230 at the moment and I haven’t gotten heavier for quite a while. How tall are you dude?

        • mike d says:

          5 foot 10 and one quarter inch

          • Steve says:

            I have trouble eating enough in one sitting. Because of my schedule, I can only eat my first meal around 4pm or between 8:30-9pm. I usually go to bed around 11pm. If I try to cram it all in at 8:30 or later, its makes it harder for me to fall asleep. Do you think that splitting it up by having half the food at 4pm and the other half at 8:30pm cause more fat gain?

            • CHIEF says:

              This is going to be a serious brain-gang-banging so try to grasp it homie, its complicated. 🙂

              Fat gain will not ever be directly cased by meal timing. It is a factor in the obesity epidemic because it’s a linked to obesity but not the cause. Meal timing can mess with the body and cause stress on the body by being out of balance from eating all day.

              Your body is always in one of 3 possible states 1.) The body “wants” to gain weight 2.) The body “wants” to maintain it’s weight 3.) The body “wants” to lose weight. What you do in relation to meal timing can only help your body run better not cause the state of 1, 2 or 3 to happen. Potentially you can lose weight faster or start losing weight sooner but it isn’t what causes 1.) 2.) or 3.) to occur that would be the weight set point at work.

              Everyone fasts, its just a lot of people do not fast enough for their body to achieve balance and therefore are perpetually stuck in fatass mode becuase of a malfunctioning system out of balance.

              to answer what I think your trying to figure out ( which is better ?)

              Short answer
              Multiple large meals defeats some of the main goals in fasting but it is is better than 16 meals all day long which defeats all of the goals you would have while fasting during hours spent awake.

              I usually do not eat late unless I’m trying to be a fat-ass on purpose for experiments mostly because it messes with sleeping but also for a few other factors beyond the scope of a comment.

              I would suggest to make that a cut off time for you if your sleeping at 11 and try to not be eating a whole lot after 8:30 Pm. ( how do you do that ? you might ask, well simple!

              Eat more at supper so you eat less outside of supper.

              Alot of what causes hunger signals and satiety signals comes from what time you ate the last few days leading up to the day in question.

              Example : Say supper is around 6 pm after one plate your full chances are you ate a plate load of everything an 7 30 the day before and every day before that for 8 days. Well, your body expects it to happen again at 7 30 so it “leaves room” and tells you you are full at 6 pm. There are other factors but its one of the big ones in terms of time related signalling.

              it would be best to eat supper as best you can around supper time then outside of supper time, when you, in theory should be fasting after or before meal times just snack on things that do not have really large effects on the body. jerkies and cheese (in small amounts) raw veggies, nuts peanut butter berries etc.

              I’ll put a list up when i can of what works best for this.then putt all the pasta rice, juice, milk, steak burgers fries etc aka “heavy shit”/ really satisfying calorie dense foods at supper.

              The goal being to eat one large meal with 70 % or more of your calories and snack outside of it based on your authentic demands and activity level. say for instance, You bike 25 miles and start saying “I feel great on this awesome new fasting thing!” ” I don’t need to eat”, you’ll soon realize it’s the adrenaline talking. this is the hard part for most people. I don’t fast based on a preset ” magic window of fat burning potential” I eat when I’m hungry and under normal conditions this is around supper time. The matrix has em’ not being able to trust their own bodies. You need to really come in tune with your body and eat when you truly need to in order to fast properly. The funny thing is with the modern activity level this isn’t very often. The goal shouldn’t be to be hungry all day and force yourself not to eat. If your doing it right your never hungry, you feel great and you easily follow it like clockwork just like a typical 3 meal a day person. I’ll get into more how to’s in the future.

          • mike d says:

            In my experience eating like that resulted in a lower lean mass, higher body fat comparably, but I’m sure you will be fine in that you aren’t going to suddenly gain 10lbs in stomach fat.

            • Steve says:

              I get it. So on most days I will stick to eating the majority of my calories around 4ish (my first meal) and do some snacking before 8;30pm (if hungry). On most days I have clients during normal dinner hours (5pm-8pm). I’ll just eat a big serving of meat and starches etc for my first meal and some ice cream for my second.

              • CHIEF says:

                keep in mind you might see hunger pop up in the morning if you dont get enough in, just keep using the snack technique and easing into it. its kind of like a palate cleanser for meal timing. if your body gets used to no meals outside of supper it will start to allow for bigger suppers.

              • Graham says:

                The human body really does like consistency. One guy I read about said that he lost weight eating the same macro nutrients and calories (about 6000) everyday at the same time, the regular flow of food allowed his body to not feel the need for the excess bodyfat. But because he wasn’t naturally drawn to that type of eating plan and he had to exert effort to maintain it (dieting mentality), he had other health problems as a result. Never force your body to do something it doesn’t want to do even if at first glance some things seem to be going well because of it, your body will always reset to where it wants to be in the end, even if it’s not where you want it to be.

                Let your body get used to expecting lots of food at the time that’s most convenient to you, but don’t starve all day long trying to force yourself to be able to eat lots in one go. Like Chief says, snacking will help with that.

                • CHIEF says:

                  “the regular flow of food allowed his body to not feel the need for the excess bodyfat.”

                  I do think that is one of the benefits of getting on natural schedule with fasting and feasting that the body can follow on its own. The approach itself allows for physiological balance to occur. Secondarily the influx of unrestricted food has a strong effect on the subconscious.

                  • Graham says:

                    I think when your body is comfortable and not feeling threatened by your environment so that it doesn’t need to function in a conservative state, (storing body fat, being lethargic and fatigued among other things is what I’ve experienced,) body fat will disappear on it’s own. Getting in tune with your bodies feeding patterns are one of many factors in health but i think it’s a big one, or at least the mentality certainly is. I’ve seen people who don’t eat consistently or regularly but function as if they do (both aesthetically and healthwise,) their body isn’t crying out for sustenance, it’s as if it’s certain the food will come soon enough and it doesn’t have to hang on to every bit to survive.

                    The guy I mentioned said that he suffered health problems and he didn’t achieve his physique goals either, which goes to show that if your forcing yourself to either end of the spectrum, neither will do you any good. Following what your body is telling you is key, pity it’s so hard for people to get in tune with themselves due to cultural conditioning. I’ve said it already somewhere here, but I definitely think that the mind is the most important factor to get right in terms of overall health and well being, but obviously the mind and body are really one thing and affect each other very closely.

                    And yeah, just eating without restriction would do fucking miracles for most people both physically and mentally, I get tired of hearing how healthy vegetables are and how bad sugar and fat is (except for healthy vegetable oils of course, haha) by people I talk to, it’s almost maddening, (my mum thinks my health will be gone by the time I’m 30, she’s ignoring the fact that I’ve only got the energy to get off the couch for more than 5 minutes during the day for the time in years since I started guzzling saturated fat, haha.) I don’t think I realised how commonplace it is for people to worry about the food they eat until i went on a diet myself, I think it’s become normal, which is a scary thought. I’m going to have to study what caused this obsessive behaviour in people and where it comes from, it’s really strange because it certainly wasn’t always the case. Imagine if people just ate what they wanted without feeling guilty about it. The world would be a very happy place.

                    • mike d says:

                      I’m curious as to why you think the mind is the most important part. I used to think that to, but my experiences have shown otherwise. Maybe I’m missing something or interpreting something poorly. Would love to hear you, or anyone else, thoughts on the mind/mindset being the most important factor.

                    • CHIEF says:

                      I’m loving this sort of interaction here, this is my primary goal with this blog. I wrote you my thoughts on it but it got long and I decided to make it into the introduction to one of the principles instead.

                    • mike d says:

                      Awesome. I’m impatient, so hopefully you’ll be able to post it soon.

                      speaking of the mind, it didn’t take long, but I think I’ve finally achieved complete mental zombification. Its been a while since I’ve felt this type of boredom. I also sense a different type of stress I remember from back when I was a kid. I’ve been using YouTube to turn off my brain, and I have this urge to not want to do a thing. I don’t know if that’s a response to finally giving my brain a rest, or if that’s an issue with sitting at home all day watching YouTube. I’m assuming it has something to do with watching shit because when i put the smartphone down my desire to do stuff somewhat returns. my best guess is that either I’ve gone too far in the other direction, or its related to the technology in my smartphones screen
                      or I truly have not let go and still have reservation mentally.

                    • CHIEF says:

                      I’ll go with truly have not let go as my final answer. my dad uses a similar activity to “shut his brain off for sleep” ( watching movies) I often find myself doing similar things too because i think its natural in human cultures to do so. Either telling stories at a cabin without electricity with friends or having people over for supper and a movie night that you might normally only do work with to shut off the “work vibe” in those relationships to be able to sleep better after some interaction that isn’t towards a goal takes place.

                      When I got to the root of it all I realized that absolutely no stimulation was a good place to be and if …thats a big If you can wrap your head around “in the grand scheme of things none of this shit matter” and therefore have no true attachments to work, school, your favorite Tv show, what your going to eat for supper the net day, even the electricity bill being due tomorrow and not having the money for it isn’t as important as sleeping and feeling good not being fat etc…. if even not knowing where your next meal is going to come from becomes in your eyes “white girl problems” then you can enjoy complete peace and quiet and through peace find mental balance. ..that and being conscious of why you “feel” you need to shut it off to begin with and weather these thoughts are not masking feeling for some other “bigger ” issue such as a sibling dying and not dealing with it.

                    • Graham says:

                      The whole, vegging out type of state that people get watching tv and stuff before bed is a perfectly natural one, in the old days before electricity you’d have achieved the same thing sat around a camp fire or telling stories, or even just looking at the sky while the sun’s going down. Me and my brother recently started switching off the main light and switching the kitchen one on and covering half of the doorway with a towel, it feels completely different than having the main light on, much more relaxed. It’s a perfectly normal, healthy part of a human beings day, and fuck anyone who says you should be doing something ‘useful’ with that time, the most useful thing you can do is relax.

                      Glad you’re enjoying the conversations Chief, I’m just happy to have a reason to write what I’ve found down and get it out of my head so I can read it back, it’s pretty refreshing. If other people can gain something from it too, then that’s just the fucking cherry on the cake.

                      Most attachments people have are to ideas that they’ve been conditioned to believe are important, (nothing underhand going on here, the people doing the conditioning believe it too.) Things like needing to pay the electricity bill is a good example, I’ve had a few semi heated discussions with my family about the electric running out, but I honestly couldn’t care less, it’s not the end of the world by any stretch, you can always sort it out later, but the panic something so trivial can put into people is really interesting to observe. This is a big point, people feel an inbuilt panic and feel like there’s an oncoming doomsday scenario for such trivial things that in reality really don’t wield anywhere near as much power as people let them. The fear of these things is much worse than the reality and sometimes people need to experience them personally (things like, running out of money, or even losing a house or getting divorced,) to realize that life’s really not as bad as they thought (I’m not trying to trivialise these things, I’m just pointing out that life goes on and people have the real say in how much something affects them, whether they’re comfortable with that or not.)

                      Somewhere along the line since the invention of agriculture (it’s where our basic model of civilisation started, the good and the bad) being happy and healthy stopped being a priority, it doesn’t even make the list anymore. How there can be anything more important than being healthy and happy is beyond me. As long as you have that, you will always be able to sort out whatever other problems you have, they really are secondary issues.

                      Oh and mike d, I’ll explain later why I think that the mind is the most important factor, I’m just trying to figure out how to phrase it clearly without having to start a blog of my own to explain it all. I’m not saying that other things aren’t important, but I think that they fall in line quite easily without much concious effort, after you get the fundamental bits right. In short, the way you think and how you perceive the world affects how you interact with it, which changes your own personal environment. From there, things like eating right, getting enough exercise, and eliminating stressful situations and relationships becomes second nature. Personally I’ve found that I can’t improve my life in a major way by fiddling with physical things like food and exercise or even just cutting back on stress, (and I’ve fucking tried, believe me,) I clearly need to change the way my body responds to these things before I get any benefit from them to any major degree, if that makes any sense.

                    • mike d says:

                      if vegging out is a natural state to be in, then why does chief watch a lot of TV when he is in fatass mode? unless you mean a certain amount every day of not thinking.

                    • Graham says:

                      Yeah, I don’t mean all day long, and I don’t quite mean vegging out as most people mean it, I mean more heavily relaxed, sorry for the confusion. again it’s a balance thing. It’s natural to be in that state for some of the day, and it’s natural to want to be active for other times during the day. I think the sun used to help dictate this behaviour with the light levels varying through the day (and the light levels at night from the moon are important too,) before the light bulb came along and ruined everything of course, lol.

  32. Graham says:

    Mike d, I’ll keep this as basic as I can because my conclusions, though I haven’t finished studying them yet (and I’m certainly not finished applying them), have built up over a lifetime and I’ve spent the past 8 years or so specifically looking at things like this to see what drives human behaviour and how the body and mind respond to it’s environment, and how much the environment responds to the individual, so there’s a lot of information and emotional context to what I’ve seen that I’ll struggle to put into words.

    There are a tons and tons of examples of people that I’ve witnessed both over the internet and face to face that function well (both health wise and their physique) in spite of what would appear on the surface to be bad habits that should make them less than healthy, as well as my own personal experience of when I was a kid compared to now. The only logical conclusion I have left is that for want of a more accurate term, something in these people’s make up is driving them to be healthy, setting them at that point and making them vary around there instead of falling into bad health, and getting fat and all of that other stuff that tends to go with it. It’s not a genetic thing either, people can vary out of certain states, as well as back into them and they can also stay consistent for a lifetime.

    I’ve seen people that eat very infrequently, yet are still capable of taking in huge amounts of food in one sitting when they feel so inclined (they put me to shame, and I’ve been trying for over a year to build up the amounts I can eat in one go, haha) clearly their bodies are running as if that’s the norm, it expects that much food regularly and functions like it’s getting it everyday by just making up for the amounts that it’s lacking by compensating later on, the body doesn’t go into panic mode and start storing fat or raising cortisol or triggering any other negative factors (subjective of course), it merely adjusts slightly and moves on. People’s behaviour will vary slightly in subtle ways to allow them to continue functioning at their set point, one good example of this is people getting thirsty from eating too much and so they drink whatever drink it is that they’re craving, and like magic, the balance of the body is restored, they don’t eat food and then consciously go, ‘my mineral balance is off, i must drink now,’ they just drink because their body tells them it feels good.

    I recently looked through photos of myself from before I remember being stressed and chubby (about 8 – 14 years old to be exact) and compared my body fat levels and the places that it was stored in comparison to what it’s like today (I had almost no noticeable fat on me back when I was a kid, no real muscle though, but we were fairly poor and I was a tiny but underfed, which would easily account for that I suppose.) I then compared the lifestyle. I still lay around a lot and do very little exercise, I still eat tons of junk food, I still play lots of computer games, and the only major difference I could find was that for some reason, I no longer enjoyed these things, they’re fucking hard work now, I don’t have the energy to be able to fully engage with them and enjoy them. Most of the time I get really fatigued playing computer games, and instead of just lying down playing a game, I have to just lie down, not sleeping, just worn out too tired to do anything else. It sounds fucking crazy, but it’s really quite simple why. I’m not just in a stressed state where my body stores energy, but it also conserves everything it’s already got. I realised this when I was hungry but didn’t have the energy to walk to the kitchen (3 feet away) and pick up something to eat from the fridge, I wouldn’t even have to cook. I’m certain my body has learned from my past dealings with my environment because of a learned mental perception, that if it gets the cortisol up and changes my behaviour to do things to try to rectify the bad situation, (get up and look for food, hit people that make me mad, get me to move away from stressful things, etc,) that there isn’t anything I can do to fix it. It’s like I’ve learned that my best chance for survival is to just sit still using the least amount of energy possible because it’s just a waste if my body expends the energy trying to get me to do things about my situation.

    Basically, because of my perception (which was changed drastically at about 14 due to really high levels of chronic stress that still haven’t really gone,) I can’t perceive the things that I need to do to get my body to feel better and get out of this unhealthy state. Feeding on lots of food hasn’t helped, cutting back my activity to almost nothing hasn’t helped, nothing that I physically change makes an impact on the set point that I’m at. I’ve had small successes and I vary around it but nothing that really impacts my life in a major way.

    My body is definitely set at this level because of the way I perceive the world around me and the way I respond to it, and it’s a huge catch 22, because if for example, you get hungry but don’t buy any food, then the next time you get hungry there’s no food to eat, how do you know for certain that you don’t just need a good meal. All I know is that I haven’t made a big dent on my lifestyle by changing major physical variables and now I no longer have the energy to bother fucking trying. All I’m left with now as a clue of what to do next is the feelings I feel during the day, (mostly anxiety and fatigue, but I am having success addressing this the past week though, it’s not all doom and gloom, haha,) my concious thoughts are obviously not trustworthy due to my warped perception, they tell me to do things that seem like a good idea, but all they do is make me feel drained and physically wipe me out, I just did a band practise that lasted 3 hours on Wednesday and I shut straight down 5 minutes in and my kidneys or my spine started aching a lot, I was only standing up, haha. I was unable to do anything afterwards as well, I was led on my kitchen floor almost passing out and I didn’t even have the energy to move my leg out of the way of the fridge when my brother asked me to, I was that shot from it, 5 FUCKING MINUTES! This is after a year of making sure to eat lots of dense nourishing food and cutting back on my activity until I feel well enough to do it regularly, (I can count the number of times I’ve felt like I had enough energy to do anything that remotely resembles exercise in the past 5 years on one hand, I’ve still forced myself in the past, but I shut down to the point where I couldn’t lift a weight around Christmas, so I just haven’t tried since.)

    We live in a very big world full of abundant food and resources that we don’t have to try hard to get a hold of and yet people respond as if they’re starving, which they obviously are. Even if there’s lots of things like vegetable oils and aspartame and other things that we shouldn’t consume, there’s still more than enough of the good stuff for us to easily be well fed. And yet we’re not drawn to them, we’re drawn as a culture to the really bad stuff, and we actively turn away from the foods that will keep us in good health and instead starve, and get unhealthy, and obese and all manner of other things. To look at the resources available and
    compare it with the result, there’s no excuse for why we should be responding like this, there’s obviously much more going on that can’t be easily quantified in the manner that most medical researchers observe things, as in, all the physical factors going in to people, like how much food they’re eating and what type. It’s maddeningly obvious that people tend to vary around a set point (not just a body fat set point,) and that everyone’s is different. Make 2 people lead identical lives, same food, same exercise, same job, same sleep, etc etc, and you will get 2 completely different results, it can even be polar opposites. Hell, get the same person at different points in their life doing the same thing and you’ll probably get completely different results. I’m certain it all comes down to the way the body responds to stimulus based on the way the individual perceives their environment, the 2 affect each other, but down to what I’ve observed, (this will obviously be biased by my own perception,) if an individual perceives themselves to be in a good environment that nourishes and rewards them, no realistic
    amount of lack of food, sleep, exercise or whatever will take them very far out of their set point of health, and the same is true of someone who perceives their environment as stressful and threatening, they won’t be able to apply enough positive stimulus to change the way they respond without changing the way they see the world first, (calories they consume will be stored as fat when the body feels the need to get fat for example, it won’t give them direct energy like it would in a healthy individual.) Again I want to be clear, that the 2 go hand in hand and affect each other directly.

    The best conclusion I could drawn from all this is that I need to start being honest with myself emotionally and from there, allow myself to start seeing the resources and opportunities that are easily available to me, and no amount of trying to change the physical things in my life has made any real impact on the perception I already have that makes me respond the way I do, ie, being tired and chubby and lacking the energy to pursue my interests. Most of my problems with my health stem from certain events in my formative years that convinced me on some level that things that aren’t important are life threateningly massive
    (trivial crap,) and the things that are actually important (how I feel and what I think about how I should act about things that concern me,) are trivial and not even on the list of important things. It’s really a no brainer why I’m fatigued and anxious most of the time, let alone chubby. The things that aren’t actually important are mind bogglingly trivial shit and I know it consciously as well, I just haven’t figured out how to convince my subconscious yet.

    One main example is the importance that I’d been convinced to place on money, I’d saved my money ever since I was 14 in response to the stress (it’s not just the body fat set point that rises in response to stress, money tends to have a set point to, for most it’s just short of how much they’d need to feel comfortable, from what I’ve seen even rich people feel this,) until it got to the point that the fact that I had lots of money, not earth shattering amounts but lots to a teenager, made no dent whatsoever on the bills that my family had to pay and the more money I accumulated, the more bills there were waiting for me. The fear of bills to pay got worse for my family the more money I had. It never turned out that I had to spend my money on these bills either, they always got payed for, but I had to make sure to ‘play it safe’ and not spend any of my money just in case some ominous bad thing happened. Eventually when the number got big enough I realised how fucking stressful and trapping it was having money that I really didn’t want, it’s just paper, it means nothing in reality, and expending energy to store lots of it made me feel sick, so I decided to test my theories by spending it all on crap, (I bought a £700 guitar when I prefer ones in the £90 range as one example, lol.) Sure enough, the threat of bills dissipated overnight, and I’ve had severe issues having lots of money ever since because I’m still subconsciously convinced that it will be nothing but a pain in the ass for me and everyone around me. I’ve only started to get comfy in the idea of money very recently because I’ve accepted the fact that life goes on even if you live it on the streets, this has allowed me to almost completely take out the factor of money from my decision making process, it used to be a big one, just today for the first time in my life I turned down a gig (£60 easy money) because of the way they wipe me out (the last time I did one I didn’t want to do, I noticed I had stretch marks the next day months after my weight had stopped increasing, I’m certain they must have been there before because there’s no way the human body responds that quick, but still, it hit the mark in my mind.)

    Anyway, this is a rough idea of why I think that the mind (soul might be a better term actually seeing as it gets a bit spiritual in certain ways when looking at these things, lol) drives everything else, because you naturally cause it all (most of it anyway,) to fall into line when your ready for it to do so, and when you’re not ready for it, fiddling with the variables won’t change a thing long term, try dieting to lose weight and see, hahaha.

    (Sorry if this is a bit all over the place, there’s a lot to write about and I’ve left a lot out for the sake of clarity, just ask if you want me to explain anything clearer.)

    • mike d says:

      there this post is! i’ve been looking for it for a couple days now. i’ll write up a response as soon as i have some time.

  33. Steve says:

    Can eating just a little bit of pork screw things up? I like to eat a meat lasagna from trader joe’s thats a mix of beef and pork.

  34. mike d says:

    As with pretty much anything im sure a little wont kill you but if chief goes out of his way to avoid it must be pretty bad

  35. mike d says:

    Does anyone know if its ever possible to drink too much liquid calories, or is drinking a bunch of it and having sleep problems directly related indicative of a deeper issue that simply surfaces? I keep going back and forth on this issue. I am really close to leaving the internet altogether and seeing what happens right now, too. I have gotten it down to about an hour per day on average from five or more, but its pissing me off still.

    • mike d says:

      ok so i’m just gonna go out on a limb and say you can, because i can’t drink very much without it tasting bad and getting super thirsty.

      my health has made a bunch of leaps and bounds in the past month. cutting back on visual stimulation has really been a wonder. i’m still having issues with freezing cold hands (especially when i wake up in the morning), but I remember having that problem as a kid, so hopefully that means i’m close to where i was, which i will gladly take. the thing that’s been irritating to me today is figuring out what the fuck caused me to respond like this in the first place.

      i hope everyone else is doing good, or at least maintaining. Merry Christmas and such, blah blah. Bob? Graham? Steve? Anyone? haha i realized last night how hard of a time this site is probably going to have growing and maintaining a following when he is actively encouraging us to eliminate things that cause stress such as the internet, on top of already having followers that have issues with motivation and other health related shit. good times.

  36. Graham says:

    Still around man, I’ve been cutting down on stuff recently in certain areas of my life, including looking on the usual websites I go on, to see what affect it has on me, I’m never leaving permanently though, too fun chatting with you guys for that to happen. Good to hear your health is improving man, keep it up.

    I think you can drink too much liquid if you don’t eat enough as a general idea, but I don’t think it’s a core issue to worry about, providing everything else is in line. Look at the way Chief consumes liquid when he eats. Lots of food and lots of liquid to balance it. The important point is eating enough so you’re body is functioning well enough to know what it really needs. When I’m not eating enough my appetite shuts off and I need to consciously eat more food to get it to switch back on so I can then eat intuitively to get my energy levels back up. I just don’t get hungry when I’m not regularly eating enough, I fall back into conservative mode and won’t want to go and eat anything, even though I know I’m hungry.

    Personally I’ve found anxiety is the biggest thing that fucks with sleep and I would make sure you’ve got that sorted first before looking at other things. Just drink as much as you crave and if you still feel it’s too much after you’ve sorted other things, then try to expand the types of foods you eat just to make sure you’re getting enough of all nutrients and minerals so your body knows what to crave when it needs something. I doubt you’d have an issue with drinking too much liquid if all of that is in line.

    Liquid calories are fucking helpful though. When I was doing too many band practises that I didn’t really want to do, I started to get really lethargic and ill, (going on facebook made me anxious at this point because I didn’t want to see another message telling me to practise.) But after a while I realised that if I just had enough calories in me I actually forgot the stress and started to enjoy them. I found this out by taking a bottle of Coke (cheap stuff from aldi,) to every practise, and the exhaustion and burnout wasn’t there afterwards, whereas without the coke, it was like being really badly hungover, and I’d need to sleep for nearly a day to recover, and then I’d still feel like shit for another one or two. My stretch marks on my hips started healing when I started drinking a lot more coke more often as well. When I’m stressed I crave a lot more liquid calories (mostly just coke) than I do when I’m not. Based on my experience, it would be suicide not to satisfy that craving. I had a list of symptoms a mile long when I wasn’t drinking the stuff that have mostly gone away since I started doing so, without a change in activity (funny enough that list looked remarkably similar to cushing’s syndrome.) I’m guessing that the insulin response from the sugar has helped balance out the cortisol levels rising from stress and is keeping things balanced. Now all I’ve got to do is get my base levels of cortisol down to get my insulin sensitivity back up and then I doubt I’ll need the coke, just eating enough ought to cover it, my hip fat will probably disapear around then too. There’s a reason why we crave these foods and drinks though, and like I said, it’s suicide in the long run not to acknowledge that.

    Chief, here’s a good question. I’ve started to associate hormonal imbalances on the body with certain areas storing fat, for example when insulin is out of line, you’ll get hip fat, when testosterone is out of line you’ll have chest and tricep fat build up. When the people you work with lose weight, is it due to correcting hormonal imbalances and the body no longer storing the fat in those areas? Or are there other factors that I’m not aware of yet other than stress and hormonal issues that dictate weight loss/gain. If that’s stuff that you’re going to explain in your Body Weight Set Point series, I’m happy to wait, but I am curious what weight loss without calorie restriction typically happens like.

    I hope everyone had a good Christmas by the way, here’s to the New Year.

    • mike d says:

      that’s the thing, i’ve had stress licked a while ago. there was absolutely nothing going on until i stumbled across some information that heavily pointed to watching stimulating imagery can overload your dopamine centers and cause you to lose motivation and in general increase stress levels, so that’s why i’ve been giving the internet a huge rest lately (particularly porn). it’s been a slow process (and interestingly giving up masturbation seems to accelerate things), but that’s when i’ve seen the most progress i’ve seen in a while with wrinkles under my eyes, energy levels, and sex drive. so, i’m thinking that the soda with my meals was not the source of my issues, that it was probably more the 8 hours of daily youtube and porn site browsing lol.

      interesting observation about what hormones affect what area of the body on fat storage. less so that hormones affect where, that’s been shown in studies for a long time now, but more the specific hormones and their effects.

      • Graham says:

        Funny enough I would keep checking for stress that I’m not aware of if I was in you’re situation. When cortisol is chronically high, your motivation levels drop drastically, and the part of the brain that makes you go for the quick pleasure hit gets more stimulation, or something like that, I can’t remember the details.

        Hormones are the main thing I’ve been researching at the moment. I really want to nail down my understanding of that. But fucking hell, there is a hell of a lot of info to learn about them. It goes way deeper than just, “cortisol makes you get fat around your stomach.” Funny enough, when it’s interacting with the right hormones, cortisol can make you leaner. It’s when cortisol and insulin come together that you get major weight gain, which is why sugar is demonized so much, but as you know there’s so much more to the process of weight gain than just getting stressed and eating a few to many chocolate bars. Cortisol certainly seems to be a major part of the state of our societies health though, because it’s that out of line, and people are taught to ignore the problems that it brings so it stays out of line for years.

        All I know is that my health issues began when I was in my early/mid teens, and my lifestyle changed drastically, and I dealt with stress for most of my day, everyday, from that point on. My appetite increased, but I didn’t actually eat much more, I just didn’t have the food about. So I’m pretty positive that most of my issues come from background levels of stress that I still haven’t dealt with, although I struggle to believe that my health and weight would magically fall in line just for relaxing. But still, spending my time without worrying about anything as opposed to being anxious about everything seems like it would be it’s own reward whether I fix anything or not. But still, I think that hormone levels account for a lot of the fat distribution that most people I’ve met call genetics, (for example, body builders who get into single digit bodyfat with a six pack, but still have a wide waist relative to the rest of them.) I think that getting my base line cortisol levels down would get me a large chunk of the way towards my health and aesthetic goals.

      • mike d says:

        believe me, i’m in constant stress checking mode whenever i’m trying to figure some bullshit out. not to the point the act of monitoring myself becomes a chore, however. some times i run into a wall because my mentality, but lately i’ve just straight up been at a loss until this porn/internet thing popped up and how it affects the brain and the eventual response from the brain is a stress one, has to be. so, THAT is where my stress was coming from. my brain is still adapting back, a process which can take months (it’s been nearly 2 and I’m still seeing improvements), and has been pretty uncomfortable (initial worsening of my insomnia, these weird headaches, some days i’m really itchy all over, brain fog, unable to think and no i really mean can’t under any conditions whatsoever think beyond one word thoughts, etc…) but when things finally level out a bit and i get a chance to catch my proverbial breath i feel soooo much better.

        interesting about your research on hormones. i personally haven’t found much use in knowing about them, although since i’ve been reading up on an explanation on how the constant stimulation of the internet affects the brain’s reward circuits, i will say it has been useful in me visualizing what is going on in my body.

        ultimately, though, and i hope you also follow this, i feel the goal is to do what is takes to gain our health back (which means focusing on what works, not what papers suggest is going on), then continue on to do what it is we most enjoy in life. i like reading up on health stuff as much as any health interested person, but i will say i’m pretty fucking tired of it by now.

        • Graham says:

          I wanted to learn about hormones and their effects on the body both on the inside and outside because, first of all I needed to know why for the past few years I’ve felt like life is a drudge even though I do the same things that I used to do and I didn’t feel like this then, and secondly, I just couldn’t believe the idea that people store fat based solely on their genetics because I have a very different fat storage pattern now than when life didn’t feel like hard work, and I was curious why. Either the idea of genetics being a determining factor is false, or my genes have changed with stress, lol.

          The goal is definitely to get my health back, my interest in all these areas stems from that and that alone, I don’t think I’d be reading and writing about it so much if I was where I want to be health wise. I also agree that more often than not, what’s right on paper can be complete crap in reality. I’m getting pretty tired of reading about health and fitness info as well, but I haven’t learnt the few pieces of the puzzle that I need to figure out yet so I keep looking, which is funny because I’m starting to think it really is just the ability to let go and relax, and allow the stress to disappear that is keeping me where I want to get to. From what I’ve learnt about hormones, when cortisol is chronically high, everything in the body eventually shuts down, literally everything gets nuked from it, it has that much influence over you, that’s why I’m trying to cut down on everything that’s even remotely stressful (internet included,) but fucking hell, I think letting go emotionally is the hardest thing to do of all the factors that affect health.

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